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Workers’ wages

Fredonia pays top dollar among Chautauqua County villages

March 24, 2013

OBSERVER Staff Report When it comes to villages paying employees, Fredonia tops the list in Chautauqua County....

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(111)

localresident

Mar-26-13 9:18 PM

Christpoher' the only reason I mentioned Donald Trump was because he is making 1.5 million dollars off of an entity that has no intention of ever making a profit (the government).

The heads of the automakers, on the other hand, they do make a profit....except GM, who still owes taxpayers $23 Billion, and I think Chrysler too. Ford managed to fix itself tax-free. If a company is profitable even after what it pays it's leaders so what? It's making a product people are buying of their own volition (this is where pharma veers off course). If they're not profitable, sombody's got some 'splainin' to do, Lucy!

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Christopher

Mar-26-13 2:52 PM

Just a hint here localresident, JUST the CEO of Toyota made about $900,000 in salary last year. GM is now limited because of the bailout, so just before the bailout, in 2008, the head of GM made $1.5 million. The next 5 guys down made more than the head of Toyota. That's just for starters, and doesn't include any other benefits, bonuses nor stock options. Those had the head of GM at a total of $15 million. I could go on and on, so happy you brought that up.

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Christopher

Mar-26-13 11:16 AM

And localresident, once again, you really need to do some research on the pay scales and number of Executives at GM versus Toyota if you want to see why Toyota basically does it better (and include Nissan, Subaru and the rest of them that have plants in the US.)You might be surprised.

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Christopher

Mar-26-13 11:12 AM

I support Unions on pay and benefits, and in many cases in their defense of ABUSED EMPLOYEES(NOTE:I said very specifically, abused) I DO NOT SUPPORT AND NEVER HAVE, THE SOMETIMES RIDICULOUS WORK RULES. (Oops, caps lock, sorry.)Example: in a UAW auto plant if a person puts in windshields and there aren't any windshields to put in, he sits. In a Japanese plant he'd be putting in batteries or something else. These are made up examples, representative of the types of things unions are deservedly bashed about. I ran a union for decades and never supported that sort of thing.

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Christopher

Mar-26-13 11:06 AM

Ripley...SHOCKING! Yep, I no longer believe we're all that far apart on many things, and you're right, guns might be the dividing line between us. But then, that's another of my pet peeves are people making political decisions on just one issue. I seriously try, and the word is TRY, not to do that. In present times I'd probably define myself as a republican, if in fact they existed anymore. The Tea Party and the Neo-cons are NOT Republicans other than in name only, just as true Liberals are NOT Democrats other than in name only. I hope this doesn't post 6 times, lol.

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RipleyResident

Mar-26-13 9:29 AM

You might find I'm also not as republican as you think, but I do tend to lean that way. You have a tendency to set me off when you throw the "right wing" under the bus for, well, lots of things.

Truth is, our government is broken. It is completely out of touch with what the general citizenry really wants, it's over-sized, fiscally irresponsible, and both sides have contributed to put us where we are.

I think you & I might actually get along if you didn't exaggerate your position. (maybe not on guns though...)

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Christopher

Mar-26-13 7:49 AM

No, not all rich people are Republicans. Yes, Unions have some bad issues. Yet since the continuous decline of unions, the pay of the CEO's has risen over 200% while the pay of the working stiff has remained stagnant or actually regressed. Not much argument there. The end of traditional pensions will eventually lead to an entire generation of elderly with little or no disposable income, and the people most responsible would end Social Security as well if they could. Those aren't Democrats responsible. By the way, I despise Michael Bloomberg. I fight with Republicans on here because it is a rare day indeed when any of you will ever mention a bad thing done by the Republicans, the entire problems in this country are because of Democrats and unions, according to most of you, and that's just nonsense. I bash many programs sponsored by Democrats. I defy anyone to find a single post by me supporting Andrew Cuomo. But, because I'm also against many Republican issues, that makes me a Liberal.

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RipleyResident

Mar-25-13 11:58 PM

I can give you many examples in production environments where unions and their labor practices create increased downtime or increased cost. I have seen machinery down, and when break time comes, the maintenance employees stop repairs and go to break. And I especially agree with your suggestion that government unions are the absolute worst, because we the taxpayer (who are essentially the employers) have no alternative but deal with it. We can't shut down the plant and move it to a non-union location.

Also, I may have been harsh grouping all unions into the "no purpose" category. I am aware that certain unions, such as the IBEW, at least as it relates to electrical contractors, provides many training opportunities to it's members, and is also not as structured in it's practices (like you must take break every 2 hours no matter what).

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localresident

Mar-25-13 11:30 PM

Oh, and for what it's worth Christopher, that wasn't me who disagreed with your multi-post. Not sure who did that. Six times though, lol. D a m n computers.

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localresident

Mar-25-13 11:25 PM

Come to think of it, the question about Dunkirk's budget can probably translate into almost every other municipality that has a school system in NYS. Teachers tend to have masters degrees, yes, but, especially in WNY, with the last dozen years or longer of seriously declining enrollment, how in the world do school budgets keep skyrocketing?

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localresident

Mar-25-13 11:00 PM

...skillset/mindset...

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localresident

Mar-25-13 10:59 PM

I work at a partially unionized company, and find many of the union employees nice people. However, the problem starts with the beaurocracy when trying to get something done. Need an extra hour with an employee for a project at a site? It turns into several phone calls and checks with managers to make sure his/her coworkers won't be infringed because of his staying over. So, this hour turns into either two, or worse, longer because now I have to explain what the objective is and what needs to be done to achieve it, possibly causing onside contractors to wait longer, costing yet more money/time, and hoping that the /mindset one employee has will translate to the other. It doesn't always happen, especially in projects that aren't undertaken on a regular basis.

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localresident

Mar-25-13 10:48 PM

Ripely, unions still have their places in certain industries, but it typically changes over time. I'm not against them 100%, but when they run out of legitimate reasons (child labor, work week definition) to get a company/industry to pony up some cash, and go off the deep end (mandatory overtime? Wtf?), their welcome has truly been worn out. But i really don't see why unions should exist in government. I know that hits very close to home for Christopher, but taxpayers should be able to manage that in some fashion without the ridiculous contracts that governments are forced to deal with now.

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RipleyResident

Mar-25-13 10:18 PM

Christopher, owning a jet makes them a republican? Better tell Bloomberg... And don't tell me he's a registered independent, who cares, he's a democrat that can't commit.

Pretty sure there are some VERY rich democrats out there. Let's see, Bill Gates, Warren Buffet (though he has supported some republicans) are two. More than half of the top 20 richest in the US are democrats.

Certainly there are rich republicans, but you seem to be the most jaded person I have ever seen when it comes to republicans = bad & democrats = awesome. Truth be told, there is good & bad on both sides, don't know how you can't see that.

Not surprisingly, I disagree with you on Unions too. They served their purpose years ago, but today the only people who make money off of unions are the folks who run them. Also, those people are democrats. There is no question that many manufacturing plants close union shops to open non-union shops, paying good wages, elsewhere.

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localresident

Mar-25-13 9:39 PM

Question, why does it cost very nearly twice the entire budget of the City of Dunkirk to run the school system within its borders?

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localresident

Mar-25-13 9:35 PM

The funny thing about that huff post article is a unionized entity blaming unions for the problem.

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localresident

Mar-25-13 9:30 PM

Those guys begging for money may not have been union themselves, but their companies are ones with the vast makeup of their labor force union supplied, with ridiculous contracts, making it near impossible to fire them, jobs banks, mandatory overtime, etc.

And let's not forget those public employees, even hundreds of them not working one single minute at full pay (including those involved in sexual misconduct), but rather sitting in rooms all day reading the paper.

www . Huffingtonpost . com/2009/06/22/new-york-teachers-paid-to_n_219336.html

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localresident

Mar-25-13 9:19 PM

Wow, I guess you really wanted to make that point.

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Christopher

Mar-25-13 8:45 PM

And, once again to Localresident, how nice of you while whining about how tough you and others like you have it, and how basically you're all responsible for anything good in the economy, to bad mouth another American company and it's products. I might add that those weren't Union guys that flew into DC to beg for money on their private jets. I doubt they were Liberals or Obama supporters either, not in THOSE tax brackets. So, while you're bashing public employees and making statements about their choices, I'd guess you need to look in the mirror about your choices if you've had it so tough. I

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Christopher

Mar-25-13 8:45 PM

And, once again to Localresident, how nice of you while whining about how tough you and others like you have it, and how basically you're all responsible for anything good in the economy, to bad mouth another American company and it's products. I might add that those weren't Union guys that flew into DC to beg for money on their private jets. I doubt they were Liberals or Obama supporters either, not in THOSE tax brackets. So, while you're bashing public employees and making statements about their choices, I'd guess you need to look in the mirror about your choices if you've had it so tough. I

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Christopher

Mar-25-13 8:45 PM

And, once again to Localresident, how nice of you while whining about how tough you and others like you have it, and how basically you're all responsible for anything good in the economy, to bad mouth another American company and it's products. I might add that those weren't Union guys that flew into DC to beg for money on their private jets. I doubt they were Liberals or Obama supporters either, not in THOSE tax brackets. So, while you're bashing public employees and making statements about their choices, I'd guess you need to look in the mirror about your choices if you've had it so tough. I

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Christopher

Mar-25-13 8:45 PM

And, once again to Localresident, how nice of you while whining about how tough you and others like you have it, and how basically you're all responsible for anything good in the economy, to bad mouth another American company and it's products. I might add that those weren't Union guys that flew into DC to beg for money on their private jets. I doubt they were Liberals or Obama supporters either, not in THOSE tax brackets. So, while you're bashing public employees and making statements about their choices, I'd guess you need to look in the mirror about your choices if you've had it so tough. I

1 Agrees | 1 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

Christopher

Mar-25-13 8:45 PM

And, once again to Localresident, how nice of you while whining about how tough you and others like you have it, and how basically you're all responsible for anything good in the economy, to bad mouth another American company and it's products. I might add that those weren't Union guys that flew into DC to beg for money on their private jets. I doubt they were Liberals or Obama supporters either, not in THOSE tax brackets. So, while you're bashing public employees and making statements about their choices, I'd guess you need to look in the mirror about your choices if you've had it so tough. I

1 Agrees | 1 Disagrees | Report Abuse »

Christopher

Mar-25-13 8:45 PM

And, once again to Localresident, how nice of you while whining about how tough you and others like you have it, and how basically you're all responsible for anything good in the economy, to bad mouth another American company and it's products. I might add that those weren't Union guys that flew into DC to beg for money on their private jets. I doubt they were Liberals or Obama supporters either, not in THOSE tax brackets. So, while you're bashing public employees and making statements about their choices, I'd guess you need to look in the mirror about your choices if you've had it so tough. I

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Christopher

Mar-25-13 8:41 PM

Localresident, thank you so much for making the exact same point I have made many, many times, that even non-union labor benefitted from unions as non-union companies were forced to give more than they would have to keep unions out. As for your point and others that people have a right to know where "their money) (tax) is spent, I agree. But, you do NOT have to know a particular employees name to know that say a DPW has 6 laborers, here's their salaries, 8 operators, here's their salaries, etc., etc. Knowing their name has NOTHING to do wit knowing how your money is being spent. Do I have the right to know how much every individual makes in this country on IRA's, Social Security, Disability and such? It's my tax money, isn't it? In answer to my own question, no I do not, nor do I need to. Insisting on names has nothing to do with knowing how your money is spent, it has everything to do with being nosy.

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