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NRG deal: Area’s voice heard in Albany

December 16, 2013

When it came to converting the NRG Energy Inc. plant in Dunkirk, it came down to one thing: the power of the people. Elected officials, including state Sen....

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(37)

TheFourthTurning

Dec-20-13 3:52 PM

And the biggest pipe dream is just that. The idea that a physical natural gas pipeline could be run with a capacity to effectively supply that plant is in itself a pipe dream. Sure, after many hundreds of millions and logistical delays, and complications it is possible, but then you have the supply problems that will arise. That is why so many other similar ideas on gas conversion plants have been shelved. Just look it up on the internet. Most other municipalities have come to the conclusion that gas conversion are not economically feasible because of supply issues.

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Steiner

Dec-19-13 8:24 AM

hey cronig and judeye, WSJ reports that US natural gas production up to 73 billion cubic feet a day .the cold weather from global warming and coal conversion plants using more gas. All from fracking. So to all you learned gals at the LWV and other learned liberals. exactly when were you gonna say what as green energy is going to replace all those BTUs we are getting just from natural gas ?

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Steiner

Dec-18-13 9:57 AM

hey naysayers, the WSJ reports otherwise. Natural gas is replacing coal. Coal is on Obamas hate list. hysterical fears of co2 when co2 does not trap heat. So if the % coal plants running continues to decrease we will see blackouts if replacement is made with natural gas. green energy can never fill the gap. wow, these posters are full of doom and gloomers.

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rumblefish

Dec-17-13 9:19 PM

rule of thumb, when your playing poker, you never "count your money till the dealing is done"

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rumblefish

Dec-17-13 9:15 PM

the old saying is don't count your chickens before they are hatched, stranger things have happened in the 12th hour, business and politics have always made strange "bed fellows"

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Nathan

Dec-17-13 7:51 PM

to the naysayers that said this would never ever happen... eat cat poop.

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TheFourthTurning

Dec-17-13 2:05 PM

SOW ME THE PROTOYPE of an existing coal to gas conversion plant (Predecessor) that is in operation as of date. --Again from Sourcewatch. Just google it with the terms "coal plant natural gas conversion" Aspen’s research uncovers no instances of coal plant retrofits to natural gas and, in fact, virtually all of the public references to conversion of coal to natural gas or repowering turn out instead to be replacements--end quote. Sounds like someone got greased and got promised some future deals waivers to go along with this charade. This whole thing will gradually die on the vine over the next few years as the logistical reality sets in of this conversion. But as long as Dunkirk gets their 12 pack money to tide them over for the next few years it will not matter anyway.

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rumblefish

Dec-17-13 1:46 PM

What were we saying about the perils of accepting a "Trojan Horse" reports are surfacing that it will be more costly and less productive to re fit then rebuild, short term measures never amount to long term gains, wait and see how PILOT AGREEMENT PAYMENTS will be affected by the inability to produce electric at estimated volume, and excessive operational costs, consumer and taxpayer will feel the brunt of this" half measure decision"

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TheFourthTurning

Dec-17-13 12:23 PM

(Cont) from below coal-fired generation infeasible due the gas supply and infrastructure required, but that it would be more cost-effective to construct new gas-fired units than to retrofit existing coal-fired units to burn natural gas. Combined-cycle gas-fired generation costs roughly $1 million per MW, installed. ---Sounds like this a political backroom deal to benefit future political figures. The reality of bringing this project to completion will be fraught with logistical impasses and budget shortfalls. Dream on everyone. Residents of the area are getting played.

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TheFourthTurning

Dec-17-13 12:15 PM

You cannot make a silk purse out of a sows ear. This from Sourcewatch**** Although some coal-fired power plants are reported to have been converted from coal to natural gas, a 2010 study by the Aspen Environmental Group for the American Public Power Association reports that such "conversions," when examined, are replacements rather than retrofits:[12] The electricity industry can theoretically switch to natural gas either by retrofitting existing coal-fired units to burn natural gas or by closing the coal plants and building new gas-fired plants. Aspen’s research uncovers no instances of coal plant retrofits to natural gas and, in fact, virtually all of the public references to conversion of coal to natural gas or repowering turn out instead to be replacements. The reason is economics. Even the U.S. Government Accountability Office (GAO), when it looked at this issue switching the Capitol Building power plant to natural gas, noted that not only was switching all U.S. coal-fi

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Steiner

Dec-17-13 10:03 AM

cronig, cuomo must know of the periodic industry shutdowns to save electricity. It happened in new england during this winter.the timing is off. It is generally a summer thing. So capacity must be getting thin. That has to figure in .you would say,here is an extension cord. Besides, i read in the observer that the plant would be able to go from start to full capacity in 10 minutes or so. A good thing to have if somewhere there is a HV failure or some problem. cuomo is thinking even if you aint

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Steiner

Dec-17-13 8:52 AM

cronig, where are you ?

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Steiner

Dec-17-13 8:34 AM

cronig, you kid yourself all the time. you ignore my repeated requests for tht govt science list. You say the govt over and over, hey cronig, if the libs like you want ever more and more laws and we got the world of science before your laws, how is it you miss the fact the these laws and by logic, the govt did not do what you believe ? Are you learning disabled , a govt emmployee , just ignorant or just a liberal? Let us know cronig.ps it was tesla who lit up buffalo from niagara falls.the first generators had tesla on the nameplate. was tesla a govt employee ? ENLIGHTEN US OH LEARNED CRONIG. tell us about the govt !

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Steiner

Dec-17-13 8:29 AM

stupid cronig is at it again. the power from the plant can be transmitted hundreds of miles . Just follow the big wires east down the 90. According to linemen, those wires feed the NY grid.cronig, ever desperate to apologize for the dumbacrats who ruined everything and gave us nothing, that cronig knows nothing abut science, electrictiy or just about everything. way to go cronig ! cronig, the guv believes like you in the extension cord theory of electricity. made possible by tesla in his day .cronig , cuomo knows, even if you dont you need some generators spinning somewhere. cronig, every post shows kow amazingly ignorant you are. the govt DID NOT INVENT THE SCIENCE WORLD. private enterprise did.golly that is a hard pill for you to swllow. coinstatntly erupting, saying the govt did it, the govt did it.no , it was genius guys, not the govt stooge emoloyee.

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Steiner

Dec-17-13 8:21 AM

more from the world of energy and its related to why natural gas is so abundant. fracking and the govt. Mexico has announced they will allow foreign investment in their oil company. this together with fracking will make north america awash in crude oil ! Yes . it will take a little time, but that is the prediction. It was the mexican govt hindering progress that finally woke up. Hey christopher and cronig. Do ya know any govt programs that work ? for the gals, see its a mans world and always will be by camille paglia. In it she says the men have invented EVERYTHING.without men life would be drastically different. so along arrive the gals at the LWV and say no fracking ! roberta , we need you now. how ya doing gals, liberals and other dinosaur thinkers ? Lets hear it liberals, judeye, paul, cronig , commentor etc ! praise the govt stooge employee ! they gave us eveyrthing , LOL

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Dcronlg

Dec-17-13 8:15 AM

This county has less than 1% of NY's population. And 2,000 people showed up to protest, in a GOP county to boot.

These aren't big numbers to make Cuomo turn his head or any body in Albany to do likewise. There's no power in these numbers at all, so don't begin to kid yourselves. Its a gnat on a rhino's backside, in comparison.

So, the plain simple fact is that reasons, that have nothing to do with "people power", made a liberal Democrat governor haul his butt to one of the farthest reaches of the state on a Sunday to salvage this city's behind.

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Steiner

Dec-17-13 7:45 AM

hey notalways. A proposal on the ballot to limit CEO pay to some multiple of the lowest paid person in the business was voted down by a good margin by the swiss. the libs started this class warfare thing. It divides america and makes us poorer for it. I know people who make really good money. for this, they work 70 hour weeks and have a lot of responsibility. Crying over who makes what is childish. Of course the libe do that always , for the libs are children in their thinking.i guess we are all supposed to be stupid and wait for the govt to do somethinng. You know like cronig always says, the govt did it.

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Steiner

Dec-17-13 7:40 AM

veteran has got it right. If we attract only tourism, we will have ignorant people. Manufacturing makes one smart. One sees how things are made. But imagine the howls from the wacko left about co2 emisions if a manufacturer were to locate here. The decline of manufacturing has caused a huge decline in intelligence. People just dont know how or even what is behind the things they buy in the store. we can thank our libs , unions and EPA for all of this. they seem bent on making stupid people.all life is kicking the can down the road. One has kids, the parents die. One works at a business, that goes bust. the only thing eternal seems to be the govt and public employee unions. they dont have to think, just mandate. what a job.

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notalways

Dec-17-13 7:36 AM

Why is it always the working middle income people that we look at? What about the hugh salaries and benefits for those on top? It seems the more we pay them and the more of them we get to fix things the worse it gets.

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Steiner

Dec-17-13 7:32 AM

christopher and his delusions again.Paul, why not make the minimum wage a hundred grand a year ! the govt says so. Dont worry about the business market or economic realities. the liberals have spoken. Christopher do you actually know anything at all ? the minimum wage was started to keep blacks out of the job market. it has worked great in this respect. Inner city unemployment is at least 25% up to 50% in the youth. pnce christopher shows he knows nothing at all aniut kobs or ecoinmics. He only knows govt mandates. Hey paul, i ask, where is that list of science projects the govt had and did to promote what we have ? was it public employee stooges ? Nope, it was private enterprise. how can you be so ignorant of history and economics paul ? How ?

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concerned

Dec-16-13 8:49 PM

Dunkirk has a short memory in 10 years they will be back in the exact position they where in last week.

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Captain

Dec-16-13 7:54 PM

Vet57: that's a good question for Edwards, Bill Daly (should be fired) and Vince Horrigan. New development at the city level? Forget it...they're still talking about the Main St train station and/or adding to the city's list of vacant lots.

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PhilJulian

Dec-16-13 7:00 PM

CHRISTOPHER - my pension has not increased in the 15 years that I have been retired. It's not how much you make. It's how you spend what you make that matters. It's a lesson that government still needs to learn.

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Veteran1957

Dec-16-13 6:01 PM

A strategic plan is not just public sector wages. It involves deciding what type of economy we are going to promote here through the many tools business as well as local, county, and state governments have at their disposal. Will we continue to accept a "whatever comes our way" approach that has resulted in Dunkirk being the social services/ welfare capitol of the region, or will we decide, then plan on an approach that maximizes the tremendous resources we have here. Will we be a tourist/ lake centered economy? Will we attempt to attract high-tech or manufacturing? Whatever it is it will require an acceptance to change and a sound understanding of economics.

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Christopher

Dec-16-13 2:51 PM

Phil, if minimum wage had kept pace with the cost of living for the last 50 years it's be about $18 an hour, maybe more. It's been stated in many places by many people that it would be more than $10 an hour just for the last TWENTY years, so $18 an hour after 50 years is way conservative. Just something to mull over.

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