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Environmentalists take it to extremes

February 10, 2014

I don’t know about anyone else, but I have had my fill of these radical groups calling themselves environmentalists....

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(121)

American

Feb-10-14 2:42 AM

Great letter now listen to the left scream

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Stanislaus

Feb-10-14 6:39 AM

Wind farms kills birds and manufacturing of solar panels includes the possible release of nitrogen trifluoride or sulfur hexafluoride... and you thought carbon dioxide was a greenhouse gas. Our energy programs are dependent on getting energy from a vast array of resources until technology catches up to our demands. It is unfortunate that environmental extremist give the rest of us a bad name... and they are no different than religious extremists around the world.

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Christopher

Feb-10-14 6:59 AM

Any chance Mr. Makuch read about that little chemical spill in West Virginia? Or the numerous pipeline breaks, leaks at that wonderful Tar sands site in Canada, or has a clue what occurred in that BP well blowout in the Gulf of Mexico? Probably not. No doubt some environmental groups are not dealing in the real world, but if not for them, the CEO's of this country would poison all of it for more profits. History is replete with examples, Love canal, etc., etc. etc. I disagree with them on sticking their noses into Dunkirk's plant and its conversion to gas, but they have done more good than harm and are the only check and balance to what business does to poison us every day.

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Griffen60

Feb-10-14 8:03 AM

Enviro terrorists !

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judeye

Feb-10-14 8:09 AM

Thank You to the extremists who brought attention to the pollution in our Lake thus forcing it to be cleaned up and stop raw sewage from flowing into it. Thank You for the extremists who brought attention the dangers of Love Canal. Thank You to the extremists who are fighting to save mountains from having their tops blown off due to greed.

Alternative forms of energy are our ONLY solution to the future. We KNOW what happens when increase in Co2 is in our atmosphere. More Co2 results in warming of the earth, which results in changes in the wind streams and ocean currents among other things. Right now Co2 is about as high as it ever has been..and yes without any doubt it is due to activities of humans. Just look at the charts of Co2 since the Industrial Revolution if you need confirmation.

It is very disturbing that papers such as this one fail to report on Climate Change, based on SCIENCE. Yet it is not surprising...

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Dcronlg

Feb-10-14 8:14 AM

Well, Mr Makuch, back in your day of wearing animal skins, using stone tools/flint points and fire was the latest thing...

Seriously, stop dragging your knuckles, cup your hands around your mouth and grunt a few more times so fellow Neanderthals will know its time to meet at the campfire..."ugh, ugh...safe, clean water, air and planet earth bad...libruls bad...ugh, ugh".

At least Steinerdzzz uses nouns and verbs.

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judeye

Feb-10-14 8:16 AM

Christopher..."disagree with them on sticking their noses into Dunkirk's plant and its conversion to gas,"

Why should not I, as someone who is very concerned about our environment, have just as much right to question this conversion as those who support the conversion?

I think we are missing the big picture. People REFUSED to hear anything other than a conversion to gas. Where were the public gatherings on alternatives? How open was anyone to anything other than what the company wanted to do? Closed minded?

I think this area has great potential to use alternative forms of energy, such as wind and solar. I think we also could convert some of our empty factories into plants producing items needed in alternative energy, such as solar panels, and wind blades.

With closed minded people who refuse to consider anything other than the status quo...that is the problem in this area. Not taxes or state requirements. It is our way of THINKING that does the most harm

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Steiner

Feb-10-14 8:43 AM

golly the stupid liberals are at it again. Where to begin ? Cronig calls one poster a cave man and then launches into a series of emotional, grunt, laden attacks. but what does cronig lack ? Not one good fact ,cronig does not realize that fire or pressure drives all of civilization. the hypochondriacs like judeye think green energy can supply the energy equivalents of quadrillions of btus. Since judeye and the other libs here have refused to say exactly how green energy can fill this void, we can think for sure that the liberals are utterly stupid people. Paul says if we heard of the chemical spill in virginia. hey paul we have had a lot of chemical spills. there are 50,000 chemicals in commerce. hey paul , did ya hear of all the school shootings? You know the place where liberals rule the roost and we have mass deaths. i dont hear a call for abolishing public schools.wow, after posting all my science facts, energy use etc, the libs jus rant about their delusions of mass death.

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Steiner

Feb-10-14 8:51 AM

judeye wants what even PBS knows will not work. green energy without a thermal back up. hey judeye you have ignored my btu question again and again. even stupid cade, after going round and around about green energy said that when the sun and wind decline we get power form the grid ! yes, the grid running with thermal backup. So judeye, you have ignored all my analytical posts about the non heat trapping ability of co2. this from many PhD chemists. judeye, they have much more science knowledge than any of the libs here. who in hades do ya think is checking the water in virginia ? liberals ? erin Brockovich, the LWV ? The aforementioned people are all luddies and too stupid to know what they are doing.

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FredoniaFred

Feb-10-14 8:57 AM

If any of you were at the NRG public hearing last August, you saw many out of town Sierra Club members come to the mic stating that using fossil fuels like natural gas was bad for the environment. They said we must invest in wind and solar power instead. These are the same people that cried out against windmills in Chautauqua County a couple years back. Seems like they use whatever propaganda they can to attempt to sway opinions as they see fit.

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Nathan

Feb-10-14 9:00 AM

I really don't even care to respond to neophyte arguments that Judeye and Christopher provide. And there is something very wrong with Dcrack... I think they need to up his anti-depressants.

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Steiner

Feb-10-14 9:04 AM

Mr Makuch notes correctly the liberal attitude. yo can have any opinion you want as long as it agrees with a liberal. If not, people like cade , conig, christopher will launch into an emotion laden attack. even gov cuomo said , agree with a liberal or get out of NY. thats called liberal largess and tolerance. you just have to agree with a liberal. liberas are stupid cronig. How is it that liberals can act the way they do ? it is because of the accomplishments of inventors, mostly guys who saw the value and help that industry could do for mankind. With very rare exception, all of it is based on fire. Cronig, take fire away and our civilization collapses. the libs descend into hypochondriac delusions cause they dont know science. the one great invention of all, habers ammonia process is kaput on the spot without natural gas and pressure. all of this is from turbines under pressure. all of this escapes the libs. His process feeds half the world. So judeye and the luddites want death.

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PR24601

Feb-10-14 9:23 AM

Christopher the WV chemical spill was related to coal cleaning toxins. You probably knew that, but I've seen it tossed about in both editorials and in the comments sections as another negative to NG, but it was completely unrelated.

The sad reality for the "wind and solar" crowd is that the manufacture of the windmills and the solar panels is a dirty process in itself. There's no such thing as "clean" energy. And as far as efficiency goes, wind is horrible. Terrible inefficient and terribly expensive. So I don't know about you Judge Judeye, but my $80/mo. electric bill is quite high enough already. Studies have shown that wind is 4-13x costlier per Kwh. How can we afford that? Or is that when I get to start receiving all that "free money" I hear about?

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Steiner

Feb-10-14 9:26 AM

Now europe is giving up on green energy. electricity in the netherlands is 40 cents a KWH. german industry says any more cost increases and they will deindustrialize germany and move to the developing countries, where stupid people like judeye cant stop science or progress.once again for stupid judeye, i say the US uses 18 million barrels of oil a day, 73 billion cubic feet a day, for heat and chemicals. a billion tons of coal a year. this is just the US. So , ignorant, conversion disordered judeye, you must answer how so called green energy will replace this. It cant make the chemicals we need. we wont have steel or aluminum. In short we will be like cronigs cave man who he mocked a previous posters as. So judeye, unless you provide an answer, please refrain from posting such ignorant, unscientific, science clueless, knowing nothing at all , the posts you post. Lets hear it judeye,Show us what a granny with all your years can do. remember you gushed over the ACA and that flopped.

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Steiner

Feb-10-14 9:35 AM

stupid judeye and love canal. oh look, another woman,louis gibbs on that one. The falls was warned not to dig it up. it was legal to bury waste. but no, the place was dug up any ways. What did ya think it was going to happen. Last i heard , NY states policy on hazardous waste is burn not bury.oh look judeye, something for you to go hysterical about. hazardous chemicals going up as co2 , water and a few other products. get a woman in industry and wait for the goof ups, they will most certainly occur. just watch the LWV. Always a goofing things up. Its cuz women are wired differently than guyhs. even hegel knew this, but there aint any gal philosophers. so the gals shoot themselves in the foot every chance they get. Its natural for them to do so.

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Captain

Feb-10-14 10:09 AM

"...seems like they use whatever propaganda they can to attempt to sway opinions as they see fit."

hmm...the same method worked well when trying to gain support to sell the CCH. I guess it's only wrong when you don't support the objective.

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CadeFoster

Feb-10-14 10:40 AM

I agree Richard, there has to be an acceptable level the Extermist will except. I would rather see a gas plant than a coal plant any time any where. At this time there is not the green tech we need to replace the plant, sure they could add some green to off set 100% fossil but burning gas is better than burning coal, anyone know that.

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Christopher

Feb-10-14 10:41 AM

PR, yes, it was NOT related to "Fracking". However, there are small LAKES of toxic water associated with Fracking just waiting for their chance to leak. All in all, Natural Gas is as good as it gets right now. The cost of most alternative sources right now is extremely prohibitive. Most environmentalists wouldn't want to pay the electric bill if the only source was wind or solar. By the way, how any environmentalist could support those windmill monstrosities is beyond me. And, not to beat a dead horse, but the best thing is to start building hydroelectric plants everywhere we can. Jobs, jobs and more jobs, and a constant and steady source of cheap electricity, cheap enough to eliminate even much of the use of gas.

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PR24601

Feb-10-14 1:14 PM

Christopher, I totally agree on the hydroelectric front. Water is tremendously powerful and clean. Surprised they haven't tapped into the tides somewhere. Instead they talk about building off-shore wind farms. A joke.

And regarding those windmills, I can't believe the greenies would allow their landscape to be destroyed with these 300' tall towers of cement and steel, seemingly everything they would be against. But then, even if every other resource was exhausted and all we had left was wind for power, they'd find a reason not to have windmills too.

I also wish we had nuclear, but that's a different discussion with different, but obvious, concerns to quell.

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Steiner

Feb-10-14 1:27 PM

what did you say cade, there is no greentech or enough of it to replace the dunkirk plant ? What ? After mocking me continually on green energy you make this statement ? You sound like obama now. You can keep your policy, but later he said he did not mean that. golly, this is great.hey posters, natural gas is thought to be renewable now,. we have pumped an enormous amount of gas out of the ground and it keeps on flowing. thank god for that. we need the chemicals. To believe that gas is renewable you would have to know science. But hardly anyone knows science. in the posts here.

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Steiner

Feb-10-14 1:37 PM

hey christopher and others liking hydropower, dont led cronig hear you say that . Why ? hydro is a form of pressure, like fire. take away the push and modern society falls apart.even a geneator under load has a great resistance to it. windmills are a joke, it would yake 150 windmills to offset the dunkirk plant.What made california prosperous in the teens and 20s and NY too ? it was cheap electricity folks. when you have arc furnces drawing 15 MW, it had better be cheap electricity. So what judeye and the libs propose is a total reversal of what made america great and propserous. chemicals leaking. i guess noone ever grew up in the shadow of steel plants when the furnaces were set to pour or when slag was dumped. Beautiful orange colors and smoke filled the sky.

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Steiner

Feb-10-14 1:57 PM

as far as i can tell nuclear power is on life support after the japan disaster. i read where germany is shutting down its nuke plants and will switch to coal . the fracking boom is helping to curb the nuclear appetite, along with a sagging economy after the jobs bills. but the environmentalists dont want anything that works.if we hydroed the entire mississippi, there is not enuf power for us. its amazing that electricity, available only in mass quantities this past 100 years or so has become so indispensible to life.Anti electricity is anti life .electricity must be one of those govt inventions i keep seeing posted here. did algore invent it ?

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judeye

Feb-10-14 4:48 PM

PR24601..if we subsidized renewable energy at the same level as we do fossil fuels we should be able to quickly develop the technology needed to bring the costs down.

How many of you have researched the Co2 levels? It is based on science..and only on science. We are reaching levels never before seen here on earth. (they can tell by ice core samples what the levels were in the past)

I really wished that we could post links here. I would love for you to read the same SCIENTIFIC (not political) articles and then comment. I would love to have good honest discussions on energy and what sources we should/could pursue for our future.

There are other sources of renewable energy we could investigate and pursue, hydroelectric is one,as is geothermal.

The issue of climate change is the most critical issue of our time..maybe of the entire human history. Are we doing everything we can to protect the future?

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judeye

Feb-10-14 4:58 PM

Is Mr. Makuch the same one who wrote the letter blasting the Sierra Club presentation...BEFORE the presentation had occurred?

They read a letter at the start of the presentation. As we sat there ready to hear what the person had to say about renewable energy and the NRG plant, someone already, maybe by ESP, knew what she was going to present.

It was funny. But then again not...

Closed minds already had their minds made up BEFORE anyone could present any alternative.

To me, that is the most frustrating. People refusing to even consider something different...

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PR24601

Feb-10-14 5:26 PM

Judeye, they already have tried to subsidize renewables like solar and wind, to the tune of PAYING them to put up windmills and build panels - and we got corruption, wasted money, and no energy.

How are you going to explain away 4-13x the cost per Kwh for wind? Do you want to pay that? Luckily no one is finding wind energy to be profitable so thank goodness our electric bills aren't headed up... yet.

Solar would be great, but it's a dirty process, and costly.

Hydro (NF) is great. And we have oceans moving constantly and no one trying to take advantage of it. The moon isn't going anywhere anytime soon. Almost perpetual motion, to take advantage of gravitational pull for energy.

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