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County: Raises win over concessions

March 6, 2014

At least three legislators got it right last week....

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(48)

Captain

Mar-07-14 6:48 PM

I don't believe PERB approves a request to decertify, I believe it's the NLRB.

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Captain

Mar-07-14 6:45 PM

De-certifying the union and leaving CCH workers w/o any representation, protection or contractual obligations afforded thru a CBA would NOT have benefitted the workers in any way whatsoever! The only reason the workers separated was b/c the CSEA couldn't legally allow concessions to just CCH workers, it would've been discriminative, so the workers felt the only way to save their jobs was to separate and offer concessions on their own. In truth, Edwards was already obsessed with selling the home, regardless of whether it became self-sustaining or not, which he made sure didn't happen. The ONLY way to prevent a sale was thru a legal guarantee requiring any sale MUST include the consent of the home's employees, and we all know that was NEVER going to happen.

Edwards, the CCLeg and the public all got what they wanted, they busted the union and sold the home, even if it took lies and misinformation to make it happen, so what else can be said?

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Hawkman411

Mar-07-14 4:45 PM

Captain - You are obviously a smart person who does his homework. But the "surplus" still involved IGT (county taxpayer) money. The CGR report had a list of money savings suggestions. About 2/3 of the total dollar amount comes from big concessions from the employees. Even with all of the savings realized, the home would still "require taxpayer subsidy." That's according to CGR's final report.

The CCH employees could have asked PERB for a vote to de-certify the union 18 months ago when they learned the union had no intention of meeting those recommendations. The process to de-certify and move TO the CSEA as union at the Jail took well over a year. That was with CSEA being in favor of it! This last move was too little and WAY too late.

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Captain

Mar-07-14 4:32 PM

"Deny, deflect and demean..." HAH! I don't deny opposing the CCH sale, and I often admit "some" criticisms against issues I support. The CGR stated the county home was operating a slight surplus, and you expected CCH workers to immediately offer concessions when they were still all one union? Did you not understand my explanation that doing so was legally impossible BEFORE a formal separation was complete?

It wasn't my intent to "demean" you by suggesting that the same people who watch FOX NEWS also watch JS & DD (well, maybe a little). It was meant to show how certain groups of viewers know what they like watching, even if it's not true. If I had used WWF fans or housewives who religiously follow daily soap operas to make my point, would that've been just as "demeaning?"

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Hawkman411

Mar-07-14 3:03 PM

Captain- I'm talking about the union being on record as not being willing to meet the concessions proposed in the CGR report that the union demanded be done.

Your talking about Fox News and Jerry Springer??? LoL...Deny, deflect and demean...typical liberal response when you've run out of options.

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Captain

Mar-07-14 2:53 PM

I'll admit, the CSEA prolonged concessionaire talks until the last minute, and you vilify them for that? Wouldn't you do the same? You assume this was meant to stall or prevent a sale, but the fact is, CCH workers were legally restricted from offering concessions until they became a separate unit, and in case you don't realize it, this was a concession in itself.

I find it interesting that you focus what the union DIDN'T do, but won't acknowledge that Edwards, Hellwig and the CCLeg could've achieved greater savings WITHOUT the union's consent, they simply defied these REAL money-saving options. The alleged $1.5M in concessions would've been a bonus, but they defiantly refused that, too. such criticism is typical of FOX NEWS viewers. FOX isn't even a news network in the truest sense. It's a form of biased & manipulated reporting aimed at people who expect FOX to deliver what they want to hear, much like why people watch Jerry Springer and Duck Dynasty.

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Hawkman411

Mar-07-14 11:42 AM

It's interesting to hear people like Captain talk about what he thinks is in the CGR report. It never said the home could be in the black under any circumstances.

The report was published in August of 2012. On page 97, CGR notes that CSEA said they have no desire to create a separate bargaining unit. 18 months later, the CCH employees finally realize the union is not working for them and sign a petition.

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PhilJulian

Mar-07-14 10:26 AM

Pay raises make no sense when you are drowning in taxation. Something has to be done to neutralize the impact of greedy unions. The best course I can think of is to reduce the numbers of their membership. Consolidating all law endorcement in the county would be a good place to start. We don't need seven full time agencies to police our county of only 133,000 residents. Merge them all into one unit under the direction of the county sheriff's department. Eliminate all unnecessary manpower, administration and equipment. Establish satellite stations in the most populated areas and utilize manpower when and where needed. The fact is that we have too much law enforcement in the county, it's far too expensive and it's not necessary.

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DarkStar

Mar-07-14 7:47 AM

Captain,

CSEA had ages to agree to concessions but they failed to respond until the Edwards had decided to sell and a vote was scheduled.

The fact that they sat on it until things had reached that point showed they were now sincere in their offer and would one to believe the offer was only made to put off any potential votes on selling the home.

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Captain

Mar-07-14 3:21 AM

If Edwards & the CCLeg would've accepted IGT funds in the last budget, the CCH deficit would've been cut in half. Further, if Edwards had complied w/the recommendations contained in the CGR audit 5 years ago, the home could've easily been operating in the black. His defiance to do neither, coupled with his refusal to accept a significant CBA concession pkg offered by CSEA employees leaves no doubt that his #1 objective was to sell the home, even though it could've become self-sustaining. Edwards & the CCLeg repeatedly demonstrated they had no interest in keeping the home county-owned. This administration has fulfilled that objective, and in doing so, the potential profits were sacrificed, many jobs will be lost, and wages & benefits will be cut.

If I worked at CCH, I'd pack my things and get as far away from this sh*t-hole and some of the worst people I've ever come to know.

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HandyAndy

Mar-06-14 9:49 PM

Niebelj writes: GreenGrass ..Did Mr. Horrigan sit down with the employees willing to make concessions? If so what was the result of the meeting?

The answer to that question is NO. Did Edwards sit down to negotiate? Yes, but walked away from an offered 1.5 million dollar concession package. That savings alone could have put the CH at a break even rate but was refused.

Let's face the truth...this all started as a "mission" for Edwards and was followed up when Horrigan took over. Until the CH was voted to sell, it would have always been an issue. North county isn't important. Even more so now that the legislative body is mainly composed of South county legislators.

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HandyAndy

Mar-06-14 9:37 PM

The petition signed by the 171 employees stated that unless the union did some serious negotiating for them they wanted to "disengage" from the union itself and find other means of negotiating concessions. Yes, rather late in the game but these employees were serious. Would they have made concessions if the vote went differently? Yes, but they would have insisted ALL county CSEA members and not just CH staff would be expected to make sacrifices. That's how it should have been in the first place. So much for union brothers and sisters...It seems the days of loyalty and banding together to help one another are long gone.

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cruisin

Mar-06-14 8:33 PM

Remember, neo-cons have a long-standing love affair for anything military. Law enforcement is just a step lower. So of course they'll always get support from neo-cons. It's everyone else they hate.

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tjefson

Mar-06-14 8:28 PM

NY news, another Democratic assemblyman found guilty of accepting bribes. What a bunch of dirt balls.

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tjefson

Mar-06-14 8:15 PM

Commentor, not only "lets be greedy", but a total lack of respect or concern for the ones paying them. They claim to be loving and caring people, yet they turn a blind eye to the pain they are causing their neighbors. My taxes and everything else has skyrocketed since BHO became president. It may not be all his fault, but one thing for certain my standard of living has taken a huge hit since 2008. Yet this privileged class, the public sector worker is shielded from sharing in the sacrifice. This group has an intent of destroying our nation. They are the most selfish group to ever walk the earth.

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commentor

Mar-06-14 6:16 PM

Too little too late. Why didn't the CCH employees do all of those things years prior. If the home was breaking even or making a profit as some think the Legislature wouldn't not be able to even raise the possibility of a sale. The attitude was let's be greedy until our backs are against the wall and then decide to do what's right.

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WishyWashy

Mar-06-14 5:18 PM

John D'Agostino is a hypocrite. He should have his wife Cathy run for Union President of the Dunkirk Teachers Association, preach to her what he prays. Lets see how her next contract goes. Go to Seethroughny**** and read her benefit pay and package. What he complains about is peanuts compared to her and her comrades.

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Niebelj

Mar-06-14 2:53 PM

GreenGrass ..Did Mr. Horrigan sit down with the employees willing to make concessions? If so what was the result of the meeting? As the sale had not been approved there was still time to try to work out a plan. What would the harm have been to explore even at the eleventh hour some alternatives? Who knows what could have happened in the future if honest discussion had actually achieved some concessions that could have been explored in future union negotiations? Administrators and managers who are only focused on their desired outcome will never change the system...never!

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Niebelj

Mar-06-14 2:43 PM

Not always... You really believe that the three Republicans voted no because they sat in caucus and decided who's turn it was to look good! What a ridiculous statement. After an entire session of demonizing the employees at CCH for benefits, and making them feel worthless you spring a resolution to give another group a pay raise? Should they then have then gone along like lemmings with the other 16. Sorry, one stood by his principles which was to cut spending and the other two had b----.

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tjefson

Mar-06-14 2:25 PM

One major flaw in this shake down is eventually the culprits will run out of other peoples money. Plus, money is exiting this state and it is being replaced with an influx of welfare recipients. Good luck reconciling this equation.

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DarkStar

Mar-06-14 2:22 PM

HandyAndy,

And you overlook the reality that the Country tried for concessions for years before they finally decided to sell the home, and the union didn't even respond until the legislature scheduled a vote on selling the home.

It was to little to late and it showed that the union wasn't serious about helping the CCH and instead simply wanted to stop the idea of a sale.

If the elections had done different, and the legislature had enough members against the sale to stop it for the foreseeable future do you really think the union, and the workers there, would have actually accepted concessions?

If you do I have a bridge to sell you.

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DarkStar

Mar-06-14 2:14 PM

Sorry my post was cut off.

It's true that the more you make/have the more you can spend, while still accumulation wealth, but look no further then various lotteries where people won millions and a few years later they are completely broke.

Getting money doesn't make a person wealthy, only saving/investing does.

While the left constantly screams about the middle class loosing is "loosing" wealth they ignore a large part of the reason why, since it doesn't advance their political agenda.

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commentor

Mar-06-14 2:00 PM

Really notalways a must be Democrat I believe they also voted no on the CCH sale. As for winning by going to arbitration why bother to go through the process. Why don't they just give them their demands and not even bother to vote. Talk about a no win situation. What private sector worker is in this position. A position to just plain rob taxpayers.

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DarkStar

Mar-06-14 1:57 PM

Marcia,

I know the left loves spouting class warfare, but you really need a new boogieman as the rant against "the evil rich" is getting old.

judeye,

Does it also honestly look at why many aren't accumulating "wealth?"

When our parents were in their 30's, 40's and 50's they knew the value of the dollar and saved whenever possible. But today everyone "needs" the newest cellphone, TV, gaming console, etc....

We have become a possession obsessed country and instead of saving we spend everything we get on toys.

Compare the contents of your house today with what was in your parents house 30 years ago and I bet there will be no comparison.

We as a society have made ourselves rich in items but poor in savings/investments which is what "wealth" is.

It's true that the more you make/have the more you can spend, while still accumulation wealth, but look no further then various lotteries where people won millions and a few years later they are comp

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joew

Mar-06-14 1:53 PM

Judeye take a look at what is happening to the middle class with the taxes imposed by your friend Obama and the burden of Obamacare. When by the way will we be getting that glowing report you promised about 5 months ago???

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